Nona Ciobanu, one of Romania's most renowned theater directors, has created a series of high-profile productions of both contemporary and classical dramatic texts. She also directed special projects, performances, installations and opera shows for which she got many awards. Her performances, often characterized by a multimedia approach, have been toured in many European countries and the USA.

Martina Mrhar Slovenian readers encounter the novel The Master and Margarita as teenagers, as it has been part of the secondary school curriculum for decades. Is it the same in Romania? What are your memories related to the first time you read the novel?

Nona Ciobanu I first read the novel as a student. I was most fascinated by the interweaving of the political, mytho-religious spectacle and the love story. I understood the true depths of the novel, its satirical humor, with which Bulgakov reveals the most terrible impulses of human nature and the overwhelming Gogolian laughter, only much later, during re-readings.

MM When did you decide to adapt the novel for a stage show? Is there a connection with Slovenian theatre?

NC Marko Bratuš saw the performance The Karamazovs at Teatrul Mic in Bucharest, whose adaptation and direction I signed, and then proposed a collaboration with SNG Nova Gorica, starting from Bulgakov's text.

MM With the decision to adapt such a complex and multi-faceted novel for a theatrical performance, there must have been a huge challenge in how you went about selecting the material. How much freedom did you allow yourself?

NC I think you have to be very careful about the ideas around which you want to build the dramatization of such a polyphonic and paradoxical text. The novel has many filters, codes and satirical subtexts and the adaptation I made focuses on the question: what do we love more truth or power? I was interested in the burlesque fantasy of the world between love and non-love, truth and lies, freedom and lack of freedom. The love story that transcends the boundaries of time and space is important. Like Faust, Margarita sells her soul to the Devil to save her lover, the Master. The devil comes to Moscow, "called" by the Master's novel, about Jeshua and Pilate. He comes as a preacher of good, as a restorer of truth and morality, revealing the superficial values of the literary and theatrical elite, as well as the weaknesses of ordinary people: greed, lies, hypocrisy. 

Evil, which manifests itself in many ways in this Moscow world, in its adaptability and versatility, today it is similar to fake news and other manipulations of our time, through which the 'cleansing' of the human mind is experimented with and by the way in which economic power subordinates the political one. In today's everyday life, we are very close to replacing love with the need to collect `likes`, `hearts` and other 'emoticons'. Margarita's love for the Master is redemptive. Sacrifice, courage, compassion and forgiveness are the weapons that defeat Woland. They are also weapons with which a person can successfully resist all attempts at manipulation and oppression that come from any controlling system.

MM Along with a strong autobiographical component, the novel opens up a series of universal questions, the central question of which is the relationship between good and evil. You also dealt with this issue during the staging of the dramatization of another magnificent Russian novel, The Brothers Karamazov ...

NC Evil always grows and spreads much faster than good. Between them lies free will. The worlds of both novels are complex, all-encompassing, multi-voiced, twisting and turning the human soul in all directions, until the last consequence. Bulgakov and Dostoyevsky are visionaries, and their texts convey the deepest human themes - love, truth, lies, the need for transcendence. Their characters are paradoxical: addicted to Evil, they sink into the abyss with lust and accept suffering as a redemptive path. The (fall) of the human being, the acceptance of evil and sacrifice offers the characters from The Master and Margarita, as well as those from Karamazov, an opportunity for spiritual transformation.

Stalinist censorship and repression deeply inspired Bulgakov in writing this novel. He burned the first version, then rewrote it and hid it for twelve years, until his last days in 1940, when he was seriously ill and blind. He made the final corrections with the help of his wife Jelena. Another 26 years passed before Yelena published the first, censored version. 'Manuscripts do not burn`. Great literature, art cannot be destroyed, says Bulgakov. It will survive criticism, censorship, it will also outgrow its time.

MM There is no more terrible human vice than cowardice. This idea connects all three levels of the novel - Yershalaim in the time of Emperor Tiberius, Pilate and the crucified Han Nasri (Jesus Christ); Moscow in the time of Stalin and the Unknown Master (Mikhail Bulgakov) and fantasy in the eternity of Woland (Satan) and all of us. The viewer of the performance should question himself about fear and courage in the context of today's socio-political situation.

There is no human vice more terrible than cowardice. This idea connects all three levels of the novel - Yershalaim in the time of Emperor Tiberius, Pilate and Khan Nasri (Jesus Christ); Moscow in the time of Stalin and the Master (Mikhail Bulgakov) and the fantasy of Woland (Satan) and all of us from eternity. The viewer should question fear and courage in the context of today's socio-political situation.

NC Even in the deepest darkness there is light, but at the same time the light often reflects the darkness. Pilate's cowardly sentencing of the innocent to death stems from his need for power and to stay in political position. His desire to correct his own mistake by executing Judas essentially justifies and legitimizes murder as a means of redemption. Pilate is unable to love anyone except his dog, he cannot trust anyone, as he is surrounded by cowards and traitors who crave power and are just waiting for their chance. The Master finally frees him, he is forgiven and he redeems himself through the suffering of guilt endured for two thousand years.The Master himself is also freed, through the suffering of the artist who had the immense courage to speak in his novel about fear and cowardice, about the truth and about the desire for power that disfigures the human being. But this courage also had areas of shadow, fear and mistrust, and that allowed the Master to be ostracized by the political mechanism he opposed. The artist becomes free by forgiving and forgiving himself, freeing his character, and himself, from the captivity of guilt. The Master's fear allowed him to get sick.

Today, when we are subjected to more subtle manipulations and a more perverse way of suppressing our free will through all the media tools, it is much more difficult to get to the truth. But it's not impossible. The characters from Master and Margarita can be models and guides for us in understanding the extraordinary power of human values, which we are slowly losing while facing the temptations and manipulations of our increasingly cybernetic world.

MM You have been involved in theater for over three decades. Has your belief in the power of art changed over the years?

NC I still believe that the theater holds up a mirror for us, it opens up an inward view, our own and also that of fellow human beings. We go to performances with the need to communicate, to understand the human soul in the world we live in. Understanding can be deepened because theater is direct, breathing and happening now. This search and poetry have always been the core of theater for me. But also the word, image, sound and physical expression of the actor.

MM The visual creation you develop together with the Slovenian visual artist Peter Košir, who is also your life partner, is very important in the performances you do together. How did this collaboration begin?

NC Our cooperation began with a video projection, which we called Hopscotch. It was created after our unforgettable trip together through Syria, through Jordan, to the Egyptian Sahara to the Libyan border. We traveled exclusively with local Arab buses for three months. The installation was presented in Ljubljana and Bucharest. Since then, Peter and I have been creating together, in theater, opera, in specific, space-bound projects, in puppet theater. Our scenographic universe is alive, sometimes it is like a character that resonates, pulsates, vibrates, here as an extension, there as a counterweight to the relationships and situations in the performances.

MM Your professor was the famous director Silviu Purcărete. What do you think is the most valuable thing he passed on to you?

NC Visual and verbal concreteness, humor and generosity of in-depth work with actors are the main guidelines that we students got from him. I have great respect for Purcarete, as I also value my other former professor, Dan Micu, one of the greatest directors Romania has ever had.

MM You have directed a lot outside of Romania. How do you see the differences and intersections between such diverse theatrical practices?

NC I searched for the theater for a long time and created projects even outside its stages, so that I would always be happy to return to the stage. It seems completely normal to me to work in the state theater in Romania, sign up for the multimedia direction of an opera show,  do a site-specific project on a Mediterranean island or in the Mayan jungle of Mexico, a performance at a Museum of Contemporary Art in the USA, a video installation in Ljubljana or to direct a show at a prestigious theater in San Diego. I believe in the syncretic composition of artistic practices. New meetings and relationships, experiences that shape and inspire you, always help you to find yourself, grow and transform and give different perspectives to see the world.

MM You are also a mother. Your dear twelve-year-old child speaks perfect Slovenian. In recent years, due to epidemiological restrictions, there have been few opportunities to visit Slovenia. Will you be able to spend more time here this year?

NC Our child thoroughly enjoyed this summer, which she spent in Slovenia with her family and friends. She also spent quite a bit of time at rehearsals in the theater, where the actors and part of the theater team from Nova Gorica helped her take her first step towards Bulgakov.

Primorske Novice, 21st of Sept. 2022, Translated by Rok Hajnšek